Not happy with your fuzzy, not-very-sharp pictures?

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Not happy with your fuzzy, not-very-sharp pictures?

Postby DickK » Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:42 am

Recently I got into a discussion with a friend who bought a new high-end super-zoom camera a few months ago. Despite all the reviews and theoretical capabilities of the camera, he complained to me that the camera just couldn't manage to take really sharp pictures. That prompted a discussion I thought might be something that would be useful to get your comments on. The essential point of what I told him was that I felt sure the problem was the user and not the camera--well at least not flaws with the camera. Just the opposite, in fact, it was the features of the camera that made it easy to have this kind of problem, mainly for two reasons.

1. It's easy to zoom out to a 200 or 300mm equivalent telephoto. With my old SLR I knew I'd done that 'cause I switched to a long, heavy lens. And a long lens magnifies every bit of image motion or camera shake--now we've got the long lens but we forget it. Oh, and the camera is light so there's less mass to resist the inevitable motion.

2. Couple that with the fact that the lens on any super zoom can't be optimized for any focal length (or even a narrow range), and has to be made for far less than the price of the old zoom, so it's not "fast".

My thinking is that we get a long lens, a "slow" lens that is lightweight and easy to zoom with little thought--ideal conditions to create fuzzy images in anything less than direct sunlight and very steady hands. I'm not sure if it would even help, but the camera in question doesn't have an image stabilization system.

I've seen this in my own camera (Fuji S9100) which is functionally very much like his. I've found absolutely nothing to criticize about the performance of the camera. On the other hand, I've found that I really have to take enormous care with my shots if I want the sharpness to be there when all those pixels get displayed at full resolution. My old rule of thumb in the 35mm world was to use a tripod with anything over about 150-200mm even in sunlight, unless I could use fast film to keep the shutter speed above 1/125th--or just expect images that weren't razor sharp. I've rediscovered the wisdom of that all over again.

So, what to do? I don't think anything will fix it entirely unless you refuse to shoot in less than bright sun at focal lengths 1/2 or less of what the camera can do. Things that I do that, I think, help --

-- use a faster shutter with flash fill lots of times to boost the light level (works very well indoor and out)
-- break out the full sized or table-top tripod whenever I can
-- counter the camera shake by putting it on a table top or braced on a wall corner (the movable view finder helps here!)
-- simply know the problem is there and really work at steady hands

I don't think the problem he has seen is particular to his camera (or my S9100). I hear and see the same complaints from people with other cameras, point-n-shoots, superzooms and DSLRs. All those megapixels are creating expectations but the maker forgot to tell people that you'll only benefit if you really work at it.

So, what do you all think? Is there something I missed telling him, or worse, said that isn't so?
You guys have other ideas or tricks for getting the most out of these cameras?
To what extent would an image stabilization system help the problem?


Thanks,
Dick
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." Aristotle ((PSG, PSE & Fuji HS20 user)) Presentation Impact Blog

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Postby gpsmikey » Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:04 am

Couple of things to add to Dick's comments

Shoot at the "sweet spot" on the lens - usually something like F-8

I am willing to trade a bit of noise for sharper pictures -- bump the ISO up to
get that faster shutter speed.

While a tripod is the ideal, I have found that a monopod does wonders for
helping to stabilize the camera (I shoot at 250-300 mm all the time at the kids
soccer games) - I shoot aperature priority and fiddle with that a bit to try
and keep the shutter speed up better than at least 1/1000 of a second.

DO NOT use "digital zoom" - in general that was invented by the marketing
types to sell more cameras and is basically pixel replication.

The most common "unsharp" problem at high zoom is "motion" - try a
monopod and see what you think - it is amazing how much vibration/jiggling
it takes out of the camera (on my Nikon, 300 mm is about 450 equiv for 35mm) and
it does a very nice job of taking a lot of motion out but still giving you plenty
of freedom to move the camera. I use it with my camcorder too - I can shoot
the kids concert where at wide angle I have the whole band and at full zoom, it
is only my daughters face in the picture and still quite stable. Here is the one
I use:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/3 ... nopod.html

mikey
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mikey (PSP6, Photoshop CS6, Vegas Pro 14, Acid 7, BluffTitler, Nikon D300s, D810)
Lots of PIC and Arduino microprocessor stuff too !!

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Postby nannybear » Fri Nov 02, 2007 11:32 am

The big thing with the types of cameras we have is people thinking they are P & S. I bought mine from Future Shop at a discount because someone returned it and it didn't have a box. For the 100.00 off I didn't care. When I got home and started playing with it, there were two pictures on it from the previous owners. Given the quality, they definitely thought it was a point and shoot!! :lol: :lol: Cheers Jan
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Postby marmart » Fri Nov 02, 2007 11:34 am

gpsmikey wrote:Couple of things to add to Dick's comments


While a tripod is the ideal, I have found that a monopod does wonders for
helping to stabilize the camera (I shoot at 250-300 mm all the time at the kids
soccer games) - I shoot aperature priority and fiddle with that a bit to try
and keep the shutter speed up better than at least 1/1000 of a second.

mikey


Ditto Mikey! I haven't dragged out my tri since I got my mono 2 years ago...I LOVE it!!

Thanks!

Mary

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Postby LEE7 » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:28 pm

Hi
Nowt to do with stills, but I`ve used a monopod with a foam grip near the top to balance a camcorder, & use as a poor mans steadicam, great for moving around your subject, using the lcd screen.

Regards.


Peter.

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Postby briancbb » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:30 pm

I have an old Olympus C2100, 2Mp, 38 to 380mm equivalent zoom. It also have IS, little spinning gyros on a movable bit of the lens system.

I have been able to have sharp images at full zoom in cloudy daylight conditions. Just cannot remember the f stop. I originally bought this many years ago because it was reviewed as the best lens available. I don't think Olympus has come anywhere near this again.

So I will add to the requirements, the lens has to have resolution capability over the range (probably covered by Mikey's 'sweetspot' comment.

Brian

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Postby BarbaraC » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:31 pm

Another old photographer trick: Take in a breath, let it out, and press the shutter release at the bottom of the breath. You're less likely to shake with empty than with full lungs.

You can also tell everyone the blurry shots were done that way on purpose because you're an impressionist. While saying this, narrow your eyes slightly to subtly give the impression that you're far above all this snapshot business. They'll either believe you or give you a good smack.

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Postby Osgood » Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:35 am

You guys have given some great advice on obtaining sharp photos.
I am just learning to drive an Oly E-500 after using an Oly C-770 for many years, and have been having some issues with out of focus photos and have come to the same conclusions that you have posted.

I would recommend that you try software that I bought a few years ago that I have really found to be very good in salvaging some photos that have been a bit fuzzy. "Focus Magic" (http://www.focusmagic.com) works as a stand alone program or a plugin for Photoshop and Ulead PhotoImpact. (which I use)

It seems to work better than 'unsharp mask' or other sharpening effects in photo software.
"Don't try to teach pigs to sing. It wastes your time, and annoys the pig."

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Postby DickK » Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:35 pm

Mikey, et al, I just added a monopod to my Christmas wish list!

I really, really like my camera but that long zoom makes it really easy to take pictures that won't be sharp.

Dick
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." Aristotle ((PSG, PSE & Fuji HS20 user)) Presentation Impact Blog

XaiLo

Postby XaiLo » Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:53 pm

I own a Canon S3 which I replaced with a Nikon D40 with no regrets. Though the S3 was a joy and a Swiss army knife so to speak of a camera. It was not without it's faults I can't begin to number the images that looked fine in review just to find out when they were down loaded they were out of focus. I've taken some really nice pictures with it but I missed so much more. Indoors low light no flash give it up.

I once took a picture of my daughter and grandson while they were sleeping (cute photo op) the D40 got it right the fist time, out of curiousity I grabbed the S3 to see how it would compare it took eleven attemps to even get close to the D40.

Bolty

Postby Bolty » Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:16 am

Has your friend compared it against another camera of the same make and model? It may be that he has faulty optics. I know professionals that buy L series lenses for Canon and have to take them back because the build is not up to standard. It doesn't happen often but it does happen in this day and age of mass production!

Cheers Adam

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Postby Tarafrost » Tue Jan 01, 2008 10:22 am

Another few tips:

1) Use proper form in holding the camera. Elbows tucked in, locked against the body and camera braced against face....lots of advice on the internet regarding proper form.

2) Get VR/IS-enabled lens or camera, if you don't already have one that is. Mind you, this can be expensive.

3) Get faster glass. A pro-grade f2.8 lens will give you faster shutter speeds than a consumer f5.6 one. This presumes the use of a DSLR and not a P&S rig.

4) Learn how your autofocus works. Many out of focus shots are due to the photographer not knowing how their equipment locks in the focus. Classic example is a shot of two people side by each, with them blurry and the background tack sharp, due to the camera focus sensor landing in between the two torsos.

5) Turn off "idiot" (eg. auto) mode and learn how to use some of the more manual modes like shutter or aperture priority. Or use Program mode, and learn how shutter speed, aperture and ISO inter-react regarding exposure. Lots of articles and books on that available.

6) Some people just have steadier hands than others. I can handhold down to 1/8 or 1/15th of a second on still subjects and get sharp pics, though many others can't. Practice does help, as does the breathing technique that Barbara mentioned earlier.

and if none of that works....

6) Blame it on your camera/lens! ;-)
....Andrzej (aka: the curmudgeon)

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Postby Auster » Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:31 am

One good tip I got was that if you are using the top end of your zoom, use the 2 second delay timer and any camera shake when you press the shutter will be missed, but brace yourself after you have pressed the shutter.

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Postby DickK » Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:59 pm

DickK wrote:Mikey, et al, I just added a monopod to my Christmas wish list!...

Just remembered this topic -- Santa came through for me with a nice but not expensive monopod, Canon Monopod 100 to be precise. Open fully it's tall enough for someone >6' which I'm not and collapsed it's about 18" high. Works great, tho' I've really one used it one shoot for some indoor evening pics at church. I could have used the tripod but this worked just as well since I didn't need to get out from behind the camera.
Dick
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Postby BarbaraC » Mon Jan 14, 2008 9:02 am

The greatest thing about a monopod is that we're likely to actually pull it out of the trunk of the car and bring it with us while that poor, neglected tripod sulks in the dark of the trunk.

Barbara

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