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[mfunk Profile Private message]

Vernon,

My kids have been on this swim team for years. My son has participated for 9 years! We're a fixture. That's the thing. I've gone from donating out of my "labor or love", to charging. That's why it's a tricky situation for me.

Still, I think that my prices are very reasonable. Last year the parents paid $15 for the DVD (which included photos). The swim team received $5 and I took $10 per DVD. It was easy for me to sell as a team fund raiser.

I had a parent approach me after the DVD viewing last summer and tell me "Charge more!". That was my favorite part of the night.

Michelle

[VernonRobinson Profile Private message]

Realize that this portion of the thread should probably be in the business section, but we charge $20/DVD and $25 for the Picture CD. Parents usually take one or the other with a smaller portion taking both.

[PhotoMill Profile Private message]

A very interesting talk going on here. Keeping the old addage alive that "Time is Money", it only makes sense that if something was done as a freebie for 6 or 7 years, then there should be no opposition to finally starting to charge for the work. That's 6 or 7 years of memories handed out free. Personally, I would feel no guilt in starting to charge for the work. Where else would you get professional work done for free just because you happen to have an involved child in the mix. My dentist does not scrap my bill just because my grandson plays in the same team as his son. And..., you now have a business name. That means that your work is in demand (makes for awareness, if nothing else). This also means that you have more on the go now than you did before, simply because your efforts are coming to fruition. Like anything else, the more you practice at something the better you get at it and your work should eventually sell itself.

If I were in the same situation however, I think I would be inclined to perhaps offer a discount for the first year. See what happens. Next year, up the price but offer a "loyalty" discount to those who bought from you this year. Eventually, the idea will sink in and you will be unchallenged for charging for your work by both the purchasers but more importantly yourself. (You are challenging yourself whether you realize it or not)

I also like the idea of charging for the independant disks. One is a production which has involved a lot of time, software costs, music license costs and dedication to perfection. Charging $20.00 per Photoshow is certainly not unreasonable. The other is the photography aspect. You did not just scan some pics. You were there, on site ! Your experience over the years has now qualified you to be the pro in the group. You also have had to buy the hardware and software for this part ie; half decent camera, editing software, disks, etc. We won't even talk about the "time" aspect on this one. So... charging $20-25 for this should not be anything that makes you lose sleep. This is all just part of the transition that takes place when we go from camera buff to dedicated pro.

I could go on and on with this subject but I see that I already have... so I'll can it here.

Just my 2 cents worth...
...Steve

[mfunk Profile Private message]

Steve,

I think, in my case, you cut straight to the issue with you comment "Where else would you get professional work done for free". I still find it hard to view myself as a "professional". I know I need to get over it! I am offering a service. I'm still attempting to determine the value of my service/product. I had a parent approach me last year after the Eagle Rays viewing. She looked me straight in the eyes and said "Charge more.".
But that's only one opinion. Considering the fact that almost all families involved with the team purchased a DVD, I know they value my product and felt what I charged was a fair price. BUT, the show was presented as a team fund raiser with the team getting a cut. Easy/altruistic sell. But the team really doesn't need any more banners, kickboards, ropes, or whatever. So now I don't want to share the profits. I think in lieu of raising the price, I'll just take the full amount. Not to mention I plan to sell them photo composites using photos I've taken throughout the season. And to be practical, it's a whole lot less time consuming creating those composites than it is creating a show.

But oh how I love creating those shows!

Michelle

[VernonRobinson Profile Private message]

Michelle,
Not that you need it by any stretch of the imagination, but are you considering going to the ProShow Conference in August? Also, I think Steve is dead on the money. Finally, I think I saw a pretty high end camera in one of those pictures. I just assumed it was you doing what you do. It looked like a Canon 1 series. The hardware, while important, is not the most important piece of this. What I gain from your shows is how creative you are. I also like your musical selections. Keep up the good work. I think Steve had a couple of good ideas on how to move the parents up a bracket or two.

Regards,
-Vernon

[mfunk Profile Private message]

Vernon,

What high end camera are you mentioning in one of my photos? I've used a Nikon D200 the past year. No Canon here. Yet. For that matter, I am considering purchasing the D300 and using the D200 as a backup. I seriously considered attending the Proshow seminar last November in Dallas. But after hearing how it was aimed at Gold users, I kept my money in my pocket. Is there something else coming to my area (state) soon?

Michelle

[VernonRobinson Profile Private message]

Vernon,

What high end camera are you mentioning in one of my photos? I've used a Nikon D200 the past year. No Canon here. Yet. For that matter, I am considering purchasing the D300 and using the D200 as a backup. I seriously considered attending the Proshow seminar last November in Dallas. But after hearing how it was aimed at Gold users, I kept my money in my pocket. Is there something else coming to my area (state) soon?

Michelle

Michelle,
Check here:
http://www.proshowenthusiasts.com/viewtopic.php?t=7017

and here
http://www.proshowenthusiasts.com/viewtopic.php?t=7062

Conference is set for Austin Tx in mid August. Not sure how far Austin is from you, but it sounds like it could be fun. Since this is the first one, they are limiting outside vendors, but you can read about it in the links.

Concerning the camera, I do not remember exactly which show, but it may have been an innocient bystander. It also could be my lack of gear recognition. That is most likely the case. Both the D200 and D300 are highly rated cameras. What most people fail to realize that it is the lenses that contribute the most and ultimately wind up costing the most. Once you have a lense selection you are basically locked in to a manufacturer unless you are willing to discard the sizeable investment.

[mfunk Profile Private message]

Vernon,

Thanks for the links. I'm really curious about what the conference will cover. By the way, the second link concerned using morphing software. Maybe not the intended link? lol Austin is about an hour drive time from me.

I hear you about lenses. I purchased my 70-200 2.8 VR lens last summer and love it. It cost more than the camera body. But I realize the importance of a good lens and consider it an investment. But you're right, you're pretty much married to the brand once you start adding quality lenses and speedlights. I'd certainly take a loss if I tried to sell it all. But right now I still love Nikon and don't regret investing in their equipment.

Michelle

[VernonRobinson Profile Private message]

Michele,
I updated the previous post with the correct link. It gives a bit more information on the content. Nikon makes great gear and lenses. At the time I made my decision, I decided on Canon. Both will work and unlike some others, I am not a zealot when it comes to gear. I realize that I am still the weakest link in the equation. Since Austin is so close does that mean you might decide to go?

-Vernon

[mfunk Profile Private message]

Vernon,

I am definitely considering attending the conference. It's just so convenient to me in terms of location. We have a trip planned late July and we'll most likely schedule something for August, too. Attending the conference will depend on any conflicts. I feel like I have a pretty good grasp of keyframing and masking already. I'm wondering how much I'd benefit from the training.

Now if it was a photography or Photoshop conference, I'd probably jump through hoops to be there! So much to learn, so little time on Earth.

Michelle

[Lenora Profile Private message]

Is there any way to find out how to do some of the features in the Eaglel Rays show? i.e. the one that has about 6 oval pictures and each one "flies in" and then all of them are arranged on the slide.

Doug,

I'm glad you liked the show!

If someone is looking for a high energy show like the Eagle Rays show, check out another show I created for my daughter's "Cheetahs" soccer team:

http://www.photodex.com/sharing/viewsho ... 8871&alb=0

Michelle F.

[mfunk Profile Private message]

Hi Lenora,

The best way to figure out how a keyframing sequence works (I'm assuming you have Producer, there's no keyframing in Gold) is to download the template and look at the inner workings. That's how I learned.

Do you already have the template? If not, you can download it here:

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=4141

The images are made oval by selecting the "Vignette" feature within Producer.

Hope that helps.

Michelle Funk

[photoshowstudio Profile Private messageWebsite]

Eagle Rays has saved me a whole heap of time.

[mfunk Profile Private message]

Eagle Rays has saved me a whole heap of time.

I'm so glad you found the template of use.

Michelle

[Wanda Profile Private message]

I am really new and I loved your show. How did you make the ball bounce on their heads and the kid slide into base?Thanks,
Wanda I